Comments on: Positively Positive? http://www.belgiumkneewarmers.com/2007/10/positively-positive.html Pro IS PROGRAM GO Fri, 05 Mar 2010 14:20:35 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Anonymous http://www.belgiumkneewarmers.com/2007/10/positively-positive.html/comment-page-1#comment-11539 Anonymous Fri, 26 Oct 2007 17:35:00 +0000 http://66.147.244.157/~belgiumk/2007/10/positively-positive/#comment-11539 This is from a New York Times article published on June 30, 2006:<br/><br/>Diagnostic tests that detect the illegal use of steroids, amphetamines and other substances banned in cycling and most other sports are relatively simple: a machine spits out the scientific equivalent of a plus or minus sign. The EPO test, in contrast, spits out a Rorschach blot, with results that must be interpreted by someone skilled in the art.<br/><br/>"The test is actually a very good one, but it's technically complicated," said Steven Elliott, the scientific director of Amgen, the biotechnology company that invented the pharmaceutical form of EPO. "If done properly, it works extremely well. But it's not just something that can be done by any lab."<br/><br/>http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/30/sports/othersports/30tour.html<br/><br/>Leaving aside the issue of LNDD's competence, I question the wisdom of employing a lab that goes on vacation for all of August for a race that takes up most of July and historically requires retests of samples. If LNDD wants the job, they should stick around to do it. This is from a New York Times article published on June 30, 2006:

Diagnostic tests that detect the illegal use of steroids, amphetamines and other substances banned in cycling and most other sports are relatively simple: a machine spits out the scientific equivalent of a plus or minus sign. The EPO test, in contrast, spits out a Rorschach blot, with results that must be interpreted by someone skilled in the art.

“The test is actually a very good one, but it’s technically complicated,” said Steven Elliott, the scientific director of Amgen, the biotechnology company that invented the pharmaceutical form of EPO. “If done properly, it works extremely well. But it’s not just something that can be done by any lab.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/30/sports/othersports/30tour.html

Leaving aside the issue of LNDD’s competence, I question the wisdom of employing a lab that goes on vacation for all of August for a race that takes up most of July and historically requires retests of samples. If LNDD wants the job, they should stick around to do it.

]]> By: Padraig http://www.belgiumkneewarmers.com/2007/10/positively-positive.html/comment-page-1#comment-11533 Padraig Fri, 26 Oct 2007 05:01:00 +0000 http://66.147.244.157/~belgiumk/2007/10/positively-positive/#comment-11533 All: Thanks for your comments and compliments.<br/>Snood: The expert we spoke to (who has read many EPO tests) says a properly executed test is unequivocal in its result. If the work is a little sloppy, the results will be a little wavy, but clear enough to judge.<br/>Tarik and Art: We are told that unlike the IRMS test--which can be manipulated--the EPO test has no room for manipulation in order to force a particular outcome.<br/>Zenmud: As to the substitution of labs, it is based on nothing more nefarious than France going on vacation for all of August. We like the blog, and will keep watching.<br/>Bikesgonewild: You touch on what has been the most troubling pattern of behavior I have identified with regard to the UCI and WADA: All indications are that any adverse analytic finding automatically moves to the penatly phase; there isn't a period of impartial investigation. Thanks for daring to use the "O" word--Ombudsman--that's needed given that so few trust the process. All: Thanks for your comments and compliments.
Snood: The expert we spoke to (who has read many EPO tests) says a properly executed test is unequivocal in its result. If the work is a little sloppy, the results will be a little wavy, but clear enough to judge.
Tarik and Art: We are told that unlike the IRMS test–which can be manipulated–the EPO test has no room for manipulation in order to force a particular outcome.
Zenmud: As to the substitution of labs, it is based on nothing more nefarious than France going on vacation for all of August. We like the blog, and will keep watching.
Bikesgonewild: You touch on what has been the most troubling pattern of behavior I have identified with regard to the UCI and WADA: All indications are that any adverse analytic finding automatically moves to the penatly phase; there isn’t a period of impartial investigation. Thanks for daring to use the “O” word–Ombudsman–that’s needed given that so few trust the process.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.belgiumkneewarmers.com/2007/10/positively-positive.html/comment-page-1#comment-11532 Anonymous Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:16:00 +0000 http://66.147.244.157/~belgiumk/2007/10/positively-positive/#comment-11532 ellipse overload! eek! ellipse overload! eek!

]]> By: bikesgonewild http://www.belgiumkneewarmers.com/2007/10/positively-positive.html/comment-page-1#comment-11531 bikesgonewild Thu, 25 Oct 2007 22:29:00 +0000 http://66.147.244.157/~belgiumk/2007/10/positively-positive/#comment-11531 ...yes, truly an excellent post...w/ all the talk now about a 'biological passport', i'm wondering if even that will be definitive enough to establish a reliable 'base' that can be worked with ???...<br/><br/>...i'd also like to hear some discussion from the "powers that be" regarding a neutral or as tarik mentioned, impartial, dedicated to cycling, laboratory w/ specific state of the art procedures...watched over by scientific ombudsmen...<br/>...any procedure out of the ordinary results in a pass, gone, tossed out, test results leaked, pass, gone, tossed out...<br/><br/>...now is the time & opportunity to establish a bona fide, iron clad testing procedural...<br/>...there should also be a separate facility dedicated to looking into the latest scientific information to define what direction cheating might go & eradicate it before it is utilized...<br/><br/>...yes, this would be an expensive venture but if it worked, it would add much needed credibility to the sport of cycling & would serve as a model for others...<br/><br/>...handsomely pay the best scientific minds to define & thus stop the cheating as opposed to the financial undercurrent that supports & condones the present regime...<br/><br/>...btw, nice photo of mayo & that other guy...sheesh... …yes, truly an excellent post…w/ all the talk now about a ‘biological passport’, i’m wondering if even that will be definitive enough to establish a reliable ‘base’ that can be worked with ???…

…i’d also like to hear some discussion from the “powers that be” regarding a neutral or as tarik mentioned, impartial, dedicated to cycling, laboratory w/ specific state of the art procedures…watched over by scientific ombudsmen…
…any procedure out of the ordinary results in a pass, gone, tossed out, test results leaked, pass, gone, tossed out…

…now is the time & opportunity to establish a bona fide, iron clad testing procedural…
…there should also be a separate facility dedicated to looking into the latest scientific information to define what direction cheating might go & eradicate it before it is utilized…

…yes, this would be an expensive venture but if it worked, it would add much needed credibility to the sport of cycling & would serve as a model for others…

…handsomely pay the best scientific minds to define & thus stop the cheating as opposed to the financial undercurrent that supports & condones the present regime…

…btw, nice photo of mayo & that other guy…sheesh…

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